I received an email the other day from someone telling me about a webradio show put together by a guy named Robert Bayn and his gay friend Justin. I’ve dealt with Robert before, especially when he decided to talk about ‘bug chasing.’ He finally took his post off. I was hoping he had learned from that. Robert is an ex-gay, and a new ex-gay at that. Anyway, I listened to a bit of the first show and then all of show four, which was on the question of whether or not homosexuality was a sin. It was an hour long show, so nothing short.
After it was over I posted a note at their website. I thought it was a decent and respectful post. Here is what the ad was for the show:
This week on ‘The Christian Patriot Hour’ we will be discussing the issue of Homosexuality, and how Christians should look at Homosexuality, and if Homosexuality is really a sin. This weeks show will also feature Rob’s testimony, of how God delivered him from the Chains of sin, into the hands of a graceful God, as well as Mark from Chester Street will join us. If you have any questions that you would like discussed on this weeks show, simply leave a comment with your question. Tune in Sunday at 3pm est, by going to:
Notice that Robert is inviting comments. You might also recognize the name of Mark and Chester Street. Mark, I thought, had stopped blogging a while ago and said he might be back in May, so I haven’t even checked up on him. It turns out he had been blogging on and off for a bit now. Anyway, after the show, Robert posted this:
I want to give a thank you to Mark for coming on the show this week, he is a awesome brother in the Lord. Archive of this weeks show is ready for download, you can listen to this weeks show by either clicking the Live button, or the Play button on the player.
Next week we will be discussing Theology and Christianity, with special guest, ‘The Merry Widow’.
Thanks to all who tuned in, making it our highest rated show thus far for live listeners!
Here is the exchange of comments that followed:
I just want to say that I heard your radio show today, specifically to get a better understanding as to what kind of person Mark is, but unfortunately, what I heard instead was you proselytize instead.
For the record, there is no homosexual lifestyle. I would think that the parties involved in today’s discussion would know this, but this is what happens when people focus too much on the sex.
I sincerely hope that in a future broadcast you present an equally fair and balanced view as to the debauchery that occurs within the heterosexual community and why it is you support slavery and the mistreatment of women.
June 3, 2007 7:04 PM
Robert Bayn said…
First, if you want fair and balanced, watch fox news.
Second, no where have we stated we support slavery of women or mistreating them.
Thank you for your comments, I will keep you in my prayers.
June 3, 2007 7:44 PM
All ears that are offended by God’s holiness, such accusations will be made, even if they are as basless, pointless, and ficitious fanatsy as ng has expressed.
ng, seriously, did you even listen? and why do you actually care what I think or what kind of person I am? I speak the truth, and so has Rob. Chew on it and do with it what you will. Making ficitious claims only makes the jello you claim is our ‘truth’, rock solid.
I have seen enough of your commentary to know you are a spineless swine. I know what your selling all to well.
For the record, there is no homosexual lifestyle.
for the record, I think celebrating sin is a lifestyle, and you know it.
June 3, 2007 9:15 PM
Robert Bayn said…
This is a prime example of the irrational thought process of the far left.
Apparently I’m also on the verge of a mental break down, which is furthest from the truth. Funny how these "activist" types just love to make up lies, half truths, and throw out accusations.
To God be the Glory, and may the Light and Truth of God’s Word, shine even brightly.
June 4, 2007 11:22 AM
I then added:
Robert and Justin,
I too just listened to your broadcast. You (Robert) just called NG an activist on the far left, but cannot we call you an activist on the far right? What is the difference? And what exactly is irrational about what NG said? If you believe that the passage in Leviticus is God’s word, and if, as you stated on your radio show that we are under God’s law (even though Mark disagreed with you), then you have to believe in all the rest of what is said in Leviticus. I can’t speak for NG, but my guess is that is what he meant.
Anyway, just a few comments about the show.
I found it a bit disturbing your story about the Hell’s Angel who is now a Christian. He seems to have no problems threatening a young man with a gun–I fail to see how that makes him a good Christian. Maybe you could explain that a bit more.
I am wondering why Justin thinks his life is better than other gays and lesbians. He indicated that he doesn’t go to bars or have multiple partners and this somehow makes him better. Does he have a partner? Is he totally celibate? Not all gay men go to bars or have multiple partners.
Justin also said that he is against gay marriage and special rights for gays, but right after that he said he wants the same rights for everyone. I don’t see how those two ideas go together. If marriage is forbidden for gays and lesbians, then that is not equal. And what special rights is he talking about? Please give me a list of what rights I have as a gay man that say, a straight man does not have.
It is unfortunate that Mark took a swipe at the gay community in San Francisco, where I live and he knows I live there. Sorry, but ‘sexuality is not the pinnacle’ of our lives (as he put it). Not everything revolves around sex, despite what he wants to believe. For some reason people seem to be hung up about the sexual aspect as if sex were happening in the streets in San Francisco. Once a year there is a Gay Pride Parade, but to say that that makes our lives revolve around sex is the same as saying having a Memorial Day parade makes our lives revolve around the military. Sorry, it just doesn’t work that way. However, I do appreciate that he and TMW both recognize that there are issues in the heterosexual community as well.
And Mark says above that he and Robert spoke the truth–does that mean that Justin did not? Just curious…
Anyway, I will keep listening when I have the chance.
Now as you can see, my questions are respectful and I just asked for simple replies. One would think that wouldn’t be too hard. But apparently it was. Robert left this reply:
Robert Bayn said…
Actually I never said we are under the law, if I did say that, I misspoke as that is not what I meant, however I did state that the law tells us what sin is, as Paul stated in his writings, but we are saved by grace when we accept Christ as our Lord and Saviour, and Choose to live a life of holiness. What NG said was a example of the Irrational behaviour of activist types.
As far as Barry Mayson goes, it was a funny story, sorry you have no sense of humor.
I will allow Justin to handle your questions to him.
I believe we offered a fair look at the issue of Homosexuality from a Christian perspective, we all did not agree, but we handled this subject honestly and sensibly. We did not take the low road at each other, like the accusations and nasty attacks like NG has done, this proves to me the class and dignity of a person.
June 4, 2007 5:42 PM
But actually he did. And he did not mis-speak when he did it, since he also gave an example. So I left another comment, and it is one that Robert deleted:
Thanks Robert for your reply.
In terms of what you said about the Law, it can be found at minute 34:09 where you talk about it. You said that people believe we are no longer under the law and then you cite Matt 5:17 to prove that we are. You state:
"“Now from there a lot of times the argument is that God’s law is no more/ longer in effect and after Jesus came it was no longer needed. Well, Matt. 5:17 counters that (you give the citation ) so what Jesus is saying here is the law is…he did not come to say that the law is no longer needed, but he is fulfilling the law. Through the law we know what is sin… (and so on)…The law is still the law but through Christ we have salvation from what the law does not give us…”"
The argument you are trying to counter is some people say the law is no longer in effect because we are living under Grace. But you say above that the law is still in effect. You might have misspoken, but, you also gave an example to show this.
If we are still under the law, as you say in your radio show (and even give an example of it with Matt.) then NG is not irrational. If the law is still valid (and we aren’t picking and choosing verses we think are applicable) then the issue of women and slavery (see especially Lev. 19:20-21 which deals with women and slavery) is totally rational to talk about in terms of Leviticus.
Once again you said that what NG had to say was irrational, but what part of it is irrational?
You say: "As far as Barry Mayson goes, it was a funny story, sorry you have no sense of humor." How about instead of giving me a snide remark (I actually DO have a sense of humor), reply with something a bit more mature. It is possible I missed the humor of a man holding a gun with his daughter’s boyfriend on their first date. I can see (and have seen this) occur in sitcoms where it IS funny. But you use this man as an example of a good Christian. Do you see the humor in this good Christian’s behavior, especially if this is a true story? What do guns, bullets and holding a gun have to do with Christ? I am trying to be nice here, and I just spent an hour of my day listening to your radio show, so do me a favor and give me a decent, respectable reply.
As I said, this post never made it onto his discussion. But Robert left another main post, and he had this to say:
Monday, June 4, 2007
This Thursday I will start my new job, which is a real answer to prayer. As of right now our Weekly Radio show on Sunday should be intact, if that changes I will let you guys know. Speaking of which, Comment Moderation is now in place until further notice, like many of our friends in the blogging world, we are being forced to put this blog on Comment Moderation, to keep control of this blog, from becoming a activist playground. For those who may have a issue with this, I direct you to our rules, that no Personal Attacks will be tolerated, you can kindly hit the X if you don’t like that. This is a Christian blog, and will remain as such, any persons pushing any other agenda will not be tolerated.
Well, pretty immature if you ask me. As you can see, I said nothing ‘activist.’ I cited his own words back at him, and he apparently didn’t like it. I guess that is what is going to happen when his words are recorded. He was also upset that he could not answer why NG’s comment was so irrational. Instead, I am accused of giving a ‘personal attack’ (remember, however, that he called NG irrational). I did ask for a ‘decent, respectable reply’, so maybe he thought that was a personal attack. Or he imagined it to be a personal attack. Or more likely, he realized he was wrong and did not want other people to realize that he was wrong and couldn’t handle the questions in a mature way.
Robert did allow Justin to leave a response:
- Justin said…
Kevin and NG:
"For the record, there is no homosexual lifestyle."
What rock do you live under? There definetly is a homosexual lifestyle or do you prefer the Gay life style?
Kevin: "Once again you said that what NG had to say was irrational, but what part of it is irrational?"
No Homosexual Life Style is a very irrational statement.
NG said: "and why it is you support slavery and the mistreatment of women."
Support salvery and mistreatment of women? Again what rock were you under where you heard that?
Kevin: there are just two of NG’s irrational statements.
I will go no further to answer any of NG’s irrational statements.
Yes Kevin, I am homosexual lets set the record straight the term gay means happy go lucky care free not homosexual.
Yes, I am celibate and yes I do have a roommate who like myself believes in Jesus the Christ and also believes that having indisciminate sex is not living a Christ like existence.
I do not think I am any better than any other homosexual person. I never implied that nor did I infer that you are the one who seems to think I do.
Kevin you said: "And Mark says above that he and Robert spoke the truth–does that mean that Justin did not? Just curious…"
In fact we all 3 spoke our truth as we perceive it to be. No, we do not agree on all things especially in this subject and how it should be handled. However, we are adult enough that we listen to each others side and do not try to cram our own thoughts and beliefs down the others throat.
If you listened you would have heard me ask when the last time any of them had gone into the homosexual community and got to actually know some one and talk to them about Jesus and Grace because once you get to know someone it will come up and you can discuss it without condemning them. I do not judge anyone with the law because the minute that comes up even I get the hackles raised on my neck. I talk to people about grace and what better things there are. If they decide they want to change how they live that is up to them and G*d not up to me. I am a firm believer in what Jesus’s Brother James said.
"He who teaches the law but stumbles even in the least of the law is guilty of the whole law."
I do not think I am any better than any other homosexual nor do I think I am better anyone else. Yet, I do know I personally have a better life being who I am and I know I am saved. If some one cannot live with that then so be it. I can only offer what I know and what I have if some one accepts that then great and if they dont I do not judge that is between them and G*d.
Your right Kevin I do not believe in Gay Marriage. It is not biblical so I do not support it.
And I am not the only Homosexual who does not support Gay Marriage. Although I am against it I used to jokingly ask "Why would anyone want to join a failing institution?" No I dont believe in special man made civil rights for any one group over
another. This is not hypocritical in anyway. I believe all people are to be treated with dignity and not have acusing fingers pointed at them. I am also not in favor of Hate crimes because Crime in itself is hateful and just because you make certain crimes hate crimes will that make a perpotrator any different No, it wont.
FYI Kevin Robert and I disagree on many things in the biblical area and one of them is the Law. I am a firm believer in what Paul said.
GALATIANS 2:21 "I do not set aside the grace of God; for if righteousness [comes] through the law, then Christ died in vain."
However, I think James said it best."There is one lawgiver, who is able to save and to destroy: who art thou that judgest another?"
Mark and I have had our discussions and I think when we were able to talk we found out that we were both different than what we thought. I found Mark to be a very passionate in his beliefs but not judgemental in them.
Perhaps Kevin we should all follow some of Jesus’s words.
"Come let us reason together" We dont demand the other accept our view but we respect each other enough to hear those views out. What we each do with them is up to us.
I do hope you keep listening and you will see that we have disagreements yet we have respect for each other in those disagreements. The next one coming up is going to be a good one.
June 4, 2007 8:35 PM
Now that is a reasoned and well-balanced response. He isn’t argumentative and states his case. He seems like a nice guy. It is good that he is there to balance out Robert. It would also be helpful if Justin could get Robert to ‘reason together’ since Robert seems like he just can’t get himself to do it. I listened for an hour to what Robert had to say, but he couldn’t stand to listen to a minute of what I had to say. Let us reason together? Despite being the words of Jesus, Robert just can’t do it. Oh well, I suppose I didn’t expect anything less.